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Cindy's avatar

🙋🤔Unfortunately I spent far too much time following US politics leading up to the election & my observations in response to yours are as follows:

1)The working class voted for their families

- in actual fact, the Harris/Waltz actual economic policies, raising the minimum wage, financial support for childcare & reinstating tax credits for lower income families, helping people (like innovative Puerto Ricans) establish small businesses, the exponential increase in jobs created under Biden/Harris which would have been expected to continue meaning MORE job opportunities for their families rather than less - and many more specific policies aimed at just this demographic (the "immigration" argument is a total fallacy as Biden/Harris/Walz were prepared to sign a very centre-right Immigration Bill negotiated in the Senate by both parties until Trump instructed his Republcan Senators to oppose it so he could continue to catastrophise about it, despite the FACT that illegal border crossings & deaths from Fentanyl were DOWN under Biden/Harris policies)

2)People pushed back against "woke" culture

- no-one "pushed back" - they were already the ungettable voters for the Dems & Harris/Walz having a complete lack of empathy or support for anyone who was different - partly lack of life experience (people who go to college meet & mix with real life & realise people-are-people) but also the Evangelical Christian influence which has expanded in tandem with the Trump era.

3)The economy is different now

- Kamala certainly did NOT say she would do "nothing different to Biden" - she in fact said she would continue to support the rapid job growth that meant more people were in work, but also introduced new policies to address the affordability gap with re-instating tax credits, lowering the tax rate for lower & middle wage earners, new support for child & elder care, support for buying a home or starting a small business, continuing student loan forgiveness for millions, continuing reduction in the cost of medication, addressing the price-gouging that was rampant during COVID (under Trump) & now baked in to basic pricing, protecting & expanding the Affordable Care Act (Obama-care) which Trump has vowed to (and attempted multiple times when in office) to destroy in favour of profit driven private providers

4) Trump went to where the young men were

- Trump has barely (now much more final votes are confirmed) got a majority of the votes cast, unlike the "landslide" he has been claiming, so perhaps the racist-misogynist-incel generation of young men swung the vote but I sincerely doubt ANY/MANY of them would have a) tuned in to LISTEN to Kamala (believe me they have shown no inclination to be open-minded to her candidacy!) but the people who did would either take clips out of context to support their mis-representation of her policies (case in point prisoners getting transgender surgery WHICH IS A CONTINUATION OF A TRUMP ERA POLICY 😱) OR they would mostly be Kamala supporters tuning in to her appearances, as they were already doing with enthusiasm 🤷

5) Mainstream media can seem unfair to Trump

- mainstream media objectively "sane-washed" Trump by explaining/interpreting his more insane-adjacent ramblings & presenting them in seemingly "normal" language - New York Times in particular. But objectively statistically Trump supporters don't follow "mainstream media" 🤷 The "soft Trump voter or the undecided" also statistically do not use "mainstream media" to form any view about unfairness towards Trump. They are TOLD by right-wing media outlets & personalities their interpretation of "unfairness" but don't see anything in context to decide for themselves, even if they are inclined to be "informed" Again, the transgender prisoner policy was TRUMP'S POLICY which Kamala chose not to override.

CONCLUSION - From my observations of reading & watching many sources & commentators leading up to the election, it is NOT the "economy" that has changed but the media & information sharing/delivery environment. The Puerto Ricans, Joe Rogan listeners, Fox News watchers, OAN viwers, Tik Tok followers, Facebook sharers, and possibly most significantly Elon Musk/X-crement worshippers & bot generators from proven Russian, Iranian, Chinese etc. sources, never heard about the Harris-Walz policies which could/would legitimately improve their lives & never got a sober assessment of how cuckoo-for-cocoa-puffs & legitimately dangerous for the survival of democracy in the US, and the stability of world order, a 2nd Trump term would be.

😥No longer does the population get the same FACTS which they can then decide according to their own lights whether they want to follow that path or not (so BOTH candidates had a policy of surgery for transgender inmates?) but due to today's media environment which is far more scattered & diverse than corporate mainstream sources, several hundred million American voters had no idea what they were factually voting for or against.

🤔Could Democrats do things differently? No doubt those on the far left would tell you they could stop supplying weapons to Israel, and quite frankly given the lower voting turnout from 2020 & the evident very small margin of majority to Trump in 2024, it is more likely extremely "woke" voters stayed at home or voted 3rd party & cost the Harris/Walz ticket victory 🤷⁉️

🤷All the finger-pointing & hand-wringing & analysing won't change the fact that the right-wing media protects their viewers/listeners/readers from ever finding out either what factually is happening in their country overall or in detail, or of the consequences of extremist policies they are being indoctrinated with as in less jobs, higher health costs, higher taxes, less federal support for health & welfare policies etc. compared to what the Democratic candidates are offering.

🙋And yes - there are lessons for Aotearoa - both for the "leaders" like Seymour & Peters (Luxon is simply weak & incompetent IMHO🤷) trying to push harmful agendas (not to mention many of the coalition MP's doing the same) but also our media environment. We also have information bubbles and bad actors deliberately spreading mis/disinformation to people who don't independently verify "facts" & never know objective truth on subjects of importance, beyond political party or personal prejudice into actual outcomes for real people. We have a chance to do things differently here - ironically it was Muldoon who stopped NZ from being the first stop for the Murdoch media takeover of the western world! I can't see the coalition govt doing anything to help as it suits them to have a weak "mainstream media" & fractured overall information environment, so us "woke" citizens have to step up & follow through after the Hikoi with public engagement on important issues in our own small & medium spheres of influence - we have shown we are "woke" enough to turn up & turn out for a day or so - it is much harder for the long term.

(🤷Sorry for the long rant, but there has to be SOME benefit for the hrs, days, weeks, months I immersed myself in trying to understand how to NOT have Trump elected again 😁)

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Simon Sweetman's avatar

As soon as I saw he’d appeared on Joe Rogan, I figured he’d won. I watched about half of it too - I don’t usually watch Rogan at all (by which I mean I’ve seen an episode, and some random clips, it’s not for me to regularly watch it). It was a different Trump on that podcast. Still no policy, or anything like that, but he was calm and in control, he had a message to deliver — reach the disgruntled young men that don’t bother voting. He nailed the assignment. And it felt brutal watching it and sinking into that realisation then and there.

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